Mr. Shank you stated "One of the things I’d like to see is all the department heads required to live in the city. I think that would change, it would take time, but it would change the way they think when they make recommendations.”
How exactly would that work? The city could/would loose qualified supervisors because they may not want to sell homes they own somewhere else. Are you suggesting that department heads who don't live in the city would be fired if they refused to sell their homes or would this just be new department head hires? I don't work for the city of HdG so I am just going off of my own opinion but I can assure you that if my company told me you have to move where we choose than I would choose another company to work for. Again it's just my opinion but I care more about the city employees being qualified for the job they are doing than where they rest their heads at night.
Everyone is on a kick about the government over stepping their bounds - your suggestion is a clear case of a government getting a little to big for their britches.

No need to worry...what Mr. Shank is proposing is illegal. He just doesn't know it yet.

Residency requirements for department heads and elected officials are common throughout the country. Some municipalities extend the requirement (as a prerequisite for hiring) to police officers, fire department and rescue workers, as well as other rank and file municipal personnel. It is neither illegal nor uncommon.

Residency prerequisites encourage people to live in the community where they work. In a community where I once lived, it was commonplace for people to move across county/city lines to take a better job or run for a public office. And outside government life, people move all the time to better their career. There are tens of thousands army personnel and contractors moving into Harford County now due to the BRAC relocation.

Maybe with the poor salaries paid they can't afford to live within City limits. And you can make a requirement, but you can't make it retroactive.

Residency requirements apply to new hires. Mitch Shank is calling for a 5-year-plan to make more effective City personnel policies; nobody is going to be forced to move or suddenly lose their job. These fear-mongering accusations are coming from the incumbent camp and City Hall and are unfair, baseless, and at times, just mean-spirited falsehoods. It is unfortunate folks throw stones and mud rather than discuss real issues with real impact on HdG's residents and the city's future.

It is clear to folks listening and learning about the candidates on Patch that some people spend all their online comments tearing down others rather than explaining positively the candidate they believe most suited for the job. We're seeing these comments on Barbara Wagner's pages, Mitch Shank's pages and largely, nowhere else. Every mean-spirited negative comment sends voters to the candidates with positive messages and endorsements. The muckraking thing isn't working. Try the positive tack.

We are indeed getting quite a new insight into our choices as a result of Patch and other online sources. But I have a concern. I would like to hear from the real Candidates. Or perhaps I already am. Is Walter Biller the one running for Council, or is he just Barbara Wagner's mind and mouthpiece? Is Sharron Duncan running for Mayor, or is she just Mitch Shank's mind and mouthpiece. If these candidates are indeed able to voice an opinion, let's hear from them. After all, there are not enough chairs on the dias for Walter and Sharron to sit and hold their hands after the election.

Personally I think Mr Shank is blowing smoke and throwing glitter in the air, and I hope others see this as well. He is making a lot of promises and has all these big plans, but people must remember, any policy or budgetary changes are voted on by Council - not just one person. I also think having department heads and other employees living outside City limits will make their decisions acording to the City Code and Zoning Regulations and unbiased - without favoritism.

You're right Sara...I'm starting to come to that same conclusion.

I am glad that the candidates aren't on here slinging mud because their supporters are doing a good enough job of that so the candidates don't need too. Everyone needs to realize just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them wrong and that doesn't mean that they should be attacked for it. I honestly haven't made up my mind one way or the other who I am going to vote for but I would like to say to Ms. Duncan the way you have a comment for almost everything that is said makes me wonder if I voted for Mitch Shank would I be voting for him or you? I will also say I have learned more about the candidates by the company they seem to keep than the answers they have to the questions they've been asked. To Ms. Wagner I want to say I think you have done a good job answering questions people have asked you in a professional way. I can tell you are checking Patch comments (which I am sure most other candidates are doing as well) and instead of getting into heated debates with commenter's or letting your supporters be your voice you have offered to make yourself available and answer questions.

You bring up a good point Shirley. The Patch does a great job and has got me more interested in the city election than in previous years. A few weeks ago I was indifferent to all the candidates and I really wanted to learn more. But the comments I have read by those who are supporting Mitch Shank are very agressive towards anyone who apparently dares question Shank's motives or even worse....compliment the current mayor. Yes, it seems to be just a few people, but it is a major turn off. I feel bad for Mr. Shank, I know he can't control who posts comments on the Patch, but I do not believe his supporters are helping him in a positive way.

Sara & Tom - you both have a very good point. Sara you are right if employees don't live in the city they can offer an unbiased - without favoritism opinion. Tom I also agree that if they do live here than they to have to deal with consequences of their decesions. With that being said in my opinion an employee shouldn't be forced to live somewhere just to make their boss (or other citizens) happy. Just because they don't live in HdG doesn't mean they don't love the city and want the best for it. It could be as simple as they inherited the house they grew up in and love it so much they don't want to move or they are taking care of a sick relative. There are hundreds of reason why someone may choose to live someplace and work someplace else. I live in HdG yet work in Baltimore. Do I want to live there? NO. I work in a nice area of Baltimore but it is still not where I choose to live. HdG is where I choose to live and that is my choice not my boss, a mayor or another citizens decesion.

On City Employees living in the City, there could be an inscentive in pay or disincentive in pay, depending on locale; it may make sense in that if one lives in the city, they presumptively pay City taxes and therefore are better protectors of the dollar. They also are more likely to spend their paychecks in the City, and who knows? maybe you'd run into them in real life. It throws a different compexion on things when people are accountable. I do fear that City employees, who exercise significant power, could, if so inclined, administer the city in a way most beneficial to the employees, at the expense of the City Taxpayers. I am not pointing to any one person... it is more of a mindset... After all, if the arguement about non-citizens being more objective were to prevail, why shouldn't County residents be able to vote for City Council (they're more "objective"!).

Just a little something I have noted. The Shank supporters seem to consistently pose issues & address them with some thought. The issues are the issues. I have noted that Mr. Shank does the same thing on the dias as a councilman. He addresses an issue and says what he thinks. That's a really OK thing. Everyone has a view about certain subjects, and not everyone will always agree; that doesn't make them bad. Just because people disagree with how certain aspects of city management are being handled, doesn't make that a 'personal' attack on the present Mayor. The issues which pop up between the garbage in these discussions are what we are really voting on. I stopped and chatted with Mitch at the Bulle Rock entrance when he was sign waving, and had a nice chat with him. I found him to be personable and knowledgable. I have since emailed him. He responded quickly to my question. He is accessible if you really want to talk with him. Actually, I've grown to respect Tom, Sharon and Walter for their pied piper insights in support of their favored candidate. There is no "mud" being throw by them, it seems to be thrown at them as a supporter of Mitch. It takes a certain amount of moxey to throw your persona in front of a crowd and say what you believe to be true. We are not voting on Mitch v Wayne supporters comments. But if we were, Mitch wins hands down in my book. I say, contact Mitch, I personally know he responds to his e-mails and is willing to meet with anyone who asks.

Yes, Tom, it is a rationalization. The department heads and other employees don't make the rules, they just follow them - and that doesn't make any difference if they live here or not. They may have some input, but ultimalely City Code and Ordinances are created by various committees, of which are partially made up of citizens and Council members, and go through 2 Council readings, a public hearing, then voted on by Council.

Last night, I attended a good part of the budget meeting of the Council. I found it to be very combative, between Randy Craig and Bill Martin on one hand, and Jim Miller and Mitch Shank on the other. I thought it distasteful that there were challenges issued to Miller and Shank as though they were misbehaving children just for wanting to cut the property tax by three cents, not one cent. Over and over again, Craig demanded, in avery intimidating manner, that an exact formula to cut the taxes be submitted "on the spot" -- there was no tolerance for the fact that a work session is just that -- a time to study and make suggestions. My comment is that up until last night, I enjoyed seeing governmental officials behave with professional courtesy. I did not see that last night, and seriously doubt if anything good comes from borderline bullying. The chairman of the meeting let it continue, and I don't understand why.... My question to each of the candidates is, if elected, what will you do to stop the intimidation and engender statesmanship???

City employees who don't live in the city don't get to vote in the city. No one has thought about that. So why we are all here talking about what's best for them and their jobs, they have no say. Which of course was their choice by not living here.
I have a question - has the city employees pay and performance always been such a big issue or is it just with this election? I've never really heard anything about it until this year. Everyone seems to know so much about the employees and departments but I have to wonder how much of what they think they know is true. It's easy for one person to make a statement and than 10 others run with it and before you know it 100 people have been misinformed. If someone asked everyone of us to tell them what are the qualifications to become a HdG police officer or waste/water plant employee- can we answer that question right now? Can we answer it without talking to someone else or looking things up online? Can we all do it with 100% accuracy ? I know I can't. I don't like someone who has no idea what my job really entails to tell me how to do my job and with this election it seems everyone know how to do someone else job better than them.
I would like to think city employees/citizens are spending there paychecks in HdG but let's face it we go where we get the best bargin. Aberdeen has Walmart and Target and Bel Air has all different kinds of restaruants. We only have 1 grocery store here. HdG needs more choices to keep local money local.

Jason, I have to agree that Mitch Shank has no control over the overly zealous, some might say overly aggressive, comments of his supporters, but still it does make me wonder about the silent motives of this small but outspoken group. There's clearly an orchestrated effort to suppress any and all positive remarks about Mayor Dougherty.

More to the point is the quiet restraint shown by Mayor Dougherty in light of all the unjustified negativity manufactured by the few. All who live and/or own businesses in this town have benifited from his foresighted leadership during these past years of economic turmoil. I don't even want to think about the condition this town might be in were it not for his visionary influence. Wayne Dougherty is a gentleman deserving of our appreciation. Most importantly, Wayne Dougherty is an incumbent Mayor deserving of our vote.

I'm certain that informed voters, after weighing the options and studying the facts, will vote Wayne Dougherty for Mayor of Havre de Grace.

Constance Osborne Johnson

Did it ever occur to anyone that those people that work in the city do not want to shop/socialize etc in the city? Would you want to? Would the city residents ask the police officer for advice, complain about a parking ticket? Would the city residents ask the water treatment operator why the water tastes funny? Would they ask the code enforcement officer to look into the neighbor who is putting deck on? You see my point? When people get off, they don't want to continue working!

Sharon...you seem to THINK you know a lot about the citys health and other benefits. Have you talked to any city employees? I have, and they now have a high deductible health plan that is an 80/20 split after meeting the deductible. I work in private industry and have better coverage than that! I thought the benefit of working for government wasn't the pay but the benefits. If you take away both, then you get left with the people that you may not want servicing your residents.

Integrity, honor, virtue. Government by the people for the people. I see one candidate conducting himself with a proper candor and a level of statesmanship that I appreciate. While the other candidate seems to be pointing the finger, shouting blame, attacking. Integrity, honor, and virtue are qualities that way heavy in my voting decision. 1 cents, 3 cents, 5 cents, these are things that will be quickly forgotten when the next big issue arises, but a good mayor will be remembered for many years.

Well said Mr. Lawson.

Constance stated that Mitch has no control over what his supporters say. If only that were true. Last night, after the budget hearing, the cars on Nina Avenue told a different story. Parked in front of Mitch's house were Sharron Duncan's vehicle, Barbara Wagner's and more. The whole crew that is writing the Patch responses were there. Mitch had every opportunity to bridle his supporters and has not.

Bill Lawson calls for integrity, honor, virtue. He is right. Do we really want to look forward to 2 years of what we have seen the past couple of weeks?

Mr. Gentry, I stand corrected. As I stated though, the toxic responses of a small number of Mitch's supporters do appear to be orchestrated and mean spirited.

Biller's Bikes: and why does one comment "fear-mongering accusations are coming from the incumbent camp and City Hall and are unfair, baseless ... mean spirited falsehoods" except to inflame. Like you, I was making an observation based on my perceptions and the comment threads that I've read personally.

The business setting you describe certainly sounds eutopic. Mayor Dougherty has done a tremendous job creating opportuning for the small business owners of this town.

GO RAVENS!!!!!!!

Dirtballs?????? Turn the telescope around, please.

Politicians live where they work.

Judges live where they work.

What about the joy of celebrating life with the good people of Havre de Grace?

Mr Biller, your 2008 history makes it sound like the current Mayor and Administration were responsible for RAD loans. Again, people are failing to see decisions like that are done through a committee - not just one or two people. Congratulations on your successful business in bringing visitors to the City, but unfortunately not all businesses that try to set up here have the same marketing strategies as you- is this really the City's fault? Our tourism office also does an excellent job at promoting Havre de Grace, but it's not their job either to make decisions on how a person should run their business. Of course there are Zoning regulations to follow - regulations made by committees and voted on by Council. I don'f understand what it is that you think Mr Shank can accomplish for you that isn't already being done. Any business owner or citizen can walk into City Hall to get information, ask questions, see reports, or get assistance with anything that is within their power to do and stay within regulations. Their website is full of information and easy to use. All meetings are posted and/or advertised. Public meetings are open to the public, but if you dont't go then don't say you are not being informed enough. The only thing I see Mr Shank doing, IF he were elected, would be to disrupt the employees pay scale, benefits, cut funded open positions, disrupt services, and end up losing a lot of very hard working qualitied people.

Mr Biller, your 2008 history makes it sound like the current Mayor and Administration were responsible for RAD loans. Again, people are failing to see decisions like that are done through a committee - not just one or two people. Congratulations on your successful business in bringing visitors to the City, but unfortunately not all businesses that try to set up here have the same marketing strategies as you- is this really the City's fault? Our tourism office also does an excellent job at promoting Havre de Grace, but it's not their job either to make decisions on how a person should run their business. Of course there are Zoning regulations to follow - regulations made by committees and voted on by Council. I don't understand what it is that you think Mr Shank can accomplish for you that isn't already being done. Any business owner or citizen can walk into City Hall to get information, ask questions, see reports, or get assistance with anything that is within their power to do and stay within regulations. Their website is full of information and easy to use. All meetings are posted and/or advertised. Public meetings are open to the public, but if you dont't go then don't say you are not being informed enough. The only thing I see Mr Shank doing, IF he were elected, would be to disrupt the employees pay scale, benefits, cut funded open positions, disrupt services, and end up losing a lot of very hard working qualitied people.

What I find interesting, is that I didn't mention any names; and yet it was clear who I was talking about.

Shalonn Lawson
I recently started reading the comments on "The Patch'" related to the upcoming election. I have read
comments by people I know to be intelligent who have reduced themselves to a level of embarrassement.
The comment about the "good ole boys"and the "inbreds"in Havre de grace is insulting as well as demeaning. The families and ancestors of the men and women who built this wonderful city deserve more.
I live across the street fom Mitch Shank. I am a Wayne Dougherty supporter,and before I displayed a
"Wayne Dougherty for Mayor" sign in my yard I called Mitch. I told Mitch that out of respect for him as
a friend and neighbor I wanted him to know that I was going to display Wayne's sign and we could agree to disagree politically.When this is over,whatever the outcome,I will be able to run into any of the candidates
and be proud of how I conducted myself.
Please, to all of you who are commenting on Patch,show respect to all the candidates,the citizens and
most of all respect yourselves.

Sharon, As we disagree on who we want for mayor......Your statement below, I think is really way off base

One example of an "in-town" living requirement might be to require the Department Head for DPW to live in, or somewhere easily accessible to town, just in case he might be needed to direct efficient snow removal contingencies and solve problems as a result of a winter storms. What if he lived in another county and got stuck up in the inability of that county to keep their roads clear? We also might need the DPW chief to be immediately available for flooding situations or other extreme weather situations that affect our city.

I have lived in this city for over 40 years. There has never been ONE time that the city employees have never not come through when the citizens needed them to help them. Whether it's flooding, snow removal, busted water lines, etc. I believe you only questioned all their ability to do their job professionally. Can anyone on here tell me of one incident where the city street crews and DPW failed them?

I would like to respond to Walter Biller's comments regarding the Chesapeake Cycle deal. Walter, you are right. The deal for the City RAD loan for Chesapeake Cycle was WRONG. Biller's Bikes had been in town for years and had supported this town unselfishly. I remember when you were renting the petal cars to tourists. They were great.

There are several points you may not be aware of with that RAD loan. The owner of Chesapeake Cycle was Diana Broomell's brother. The same Diana Broomell that was Manager of Main Street and is a County Commissioner in Cecil County. While she was Main Street Manager, the RAD loan committee received a letter of support from Diana Broomell sent without the knowledge or authorization of the Main Street Board of Directors. This support, believed at the time to come from the Main Street organization, helped to secure the loan.

The City and Citizens now are out nearly $100,000. We have a vacant building on Washington Street that is in foreclosure. And, more importantly, the support of that business jeopardized the health of an established business in our City, Biller Bikes.

The RAD loan program is great, when used properly. It is subject to misuse and abuse. We must be vigilant to see that the program is not used to provide monies to politically connected persons that have not provided a business plan that has a reasonable chance of succeeding.

Your business is good for Havre de Grace. The Community needs to support you.

We like Diana and her husband and consider them good friends. We believe Ms. Broomell is one of HdG's strongest advocates. Our problem is with the mayor's appointed RAD committee and the close-door nature of those deals.

One local business was prioritized over another, unfortunately a too-common story with the Dougherty administration. We're glad we hung in and HdG has at least one bike shop left to serve. Transparency in government makes for good policy. This awful deal for HdG is a perfect example of what happens when candor and open process are ignored.

Our public endorsement of Mitch Shank will illuminate a much bigger challenge which will benefit all citizens of Havre de Grace working together towards a much bigger future. We thank Patch for the opportunity. -Walter

Mr. Miller, If this is true there are serious problems!
Walter, Diana tried to put you out of business and you consider her a good friend?
Wasn't Mitch on the Main Street Board and City Council when all this happened, couldn't he stop it?
Where did the money go?

Mr Biller: It looks like you are grasping at straws. You may have a point about the cruise ships, but do you know exactly when it was that City Hall was notified of their coming? It looks to me like there are a lot more than just three businesses listed on the tourism website - under "things to do". You should contact them about getting Billers Bikes listed - maybe you have to pay to advertise like you would with any other website, I don't know that. Two weeks is not a lot of time for the City to establish an agenda for the next Council meetings - maybe they could try to get it out sooner - have you ever asked? And looking at the City websie this morning it looks like they already have the minutes posted from April 4th - your mention of "months after the fact" is a bit of an exaggeration. But yes, the best way to stay informed is to stay in close conta t with Council members, attend meetiings, or watch them on tv the next day. And finally, Labor Day weekend is important to City Hall also. I would think they must have seen it as an emergency or safety issue to close a portion of a downtown street.

Sara J: Thank you for your comments. We run a sound, respected business in a town full of good people that have shown terrific support for our business through some dire times. We never "grasp at straws." We'll be leaving our coming endorsement of Mitch Shank to speak for us through the remainder of this election. Good luck to your candidates of choice and all the others on May 3. -Walter Biller

Last night's forum at the Bulle Rock Residence Center was good and informative for votors overall. We got to see the six candidates (minus one that didnt accept their invitation) at their best and worst. I appreciated their candor in answering difficult questions but didnt appreciate the apparent leaking of questions to Mitch Shank.

His blustry, negative delivery that wore on his audience as the evening went on was made worse by his hand-written signs and rude, look-at-me behaviour. His lack of business acuman was definitely showing. I believe most of the people living in Bulle Rock are apparently unaware of his previous shenanigans and are seeking change for change's sake in Shank instead of using their brains for good.

-Tom Somerset

Tom, F Y I ... Bulle Rock is private roads - the City doesn't repair them or plow them - but their trash service is included with their water billing just as yours is.

Mr. Hurst.

You seem to have graduated from attacking candidates to attacking the Bulle Rock Civic Association, an organization which I wager you know nothing about.

Making baseless allegations about people you don't know, and then suggesting that their motives are shady based on what you made up isn't a very effective way to make friends!

There's quite a lot being said about the City government being "fat," but I haven't heard much about how and where it's fat. Is is being contended that the City has too much staff (which would suggest City employees are underworked), or is it that current staff is overpaid? I'd welcome some discussion of where and how the "axe" should fall, if indeed it needs to.

I believe the answer lies in a close evaluation of who is getting paid to do what in this city, what benefits current employees are recieving, at what cost to the city. The first question to ask would be...are pay scales and benefits comparable to the same type of jobs elsewhere? Surprisingly, HDG pay information, by job performed, is not easily available to the public. But, it is public information. Personal info like SSN's and stuff are obviously private. I certainly have my opinions from information I have looked at; but the choices are not mine to make, and my information is incomplete as to what people actually do for the money they get paid and how efficiently and responsibly individual employees perform their duties. I thought all the candidates seemed open to evaluating staffing matters as a source for redirecting funds to other obligations. Everyone was open , except Wayne, who stood stubbornly firm with his staffing choices. That seemed closed minded to me considering he is supposed to be representing all taxpayers of Havre de Grace.

I can't help but wonder if the employees of Havre de Grace, assuming everyone is performing a needed job and doing it well, might be open to an overall pay or benefit reduction in order to free up some money, instead of having to lay off any particular person? I am saying this from a perspective that my cursory evaluation indicates most everyone is receiving above average pay and benefits for the job they are performing. Maybe everyone could keep their jobs with some minor adjustments to pay and benefits. Regardless of who gets elected as Mayor, this is an issue which will be examined more closely by the City Council before finalizing and voting on the Budget

My observation is that these are not jobs of the men and women fixing the streets, manning the waste water plant, or the water dept. I understand there are way too many tourism-type jobs that pay big bucks. Let the private sector take care of the private sector.

A vote for Mitch is a vote for promises for our future.
Mitch has promised to lower the tax rate to .56 - He has no plans to cut spending to make it possible.
Mitch has promised Bulle Rock a special taxing district - It is not legally possible.
Mitch has promised to complete the bike trail to the dam - The City doesn't even own the land.
Mitch has promised a new High School - The County builds schools, not the City.
Mitch has promised changes in the High School curriculum - The City has no say, it is the County's job.
Mitch has promised everything to everyone to get elected - Consider what he can actually deliver on.

No Mike... he is in favor of those things and I personally believe with his proposed changes to Mayor Wayne's budget that he can deliver his proposed tax cut. If you are really interested come to the Council meeting meeting on the 2nd of May before the election. You might learn something.
Tell me exactly what Wayne has accomplished over four years and what he promises for the future. More of the same? How does he address the issues you stated above? Actually...exactly what issues are important to Wayne? More donations to Boys and Girls Club and the Young at Heart with taxpayer's money? Filling the empty positions at City Hall? Giving the employees a no deductable health insurance program? Raising the Water and Sewer rate? Only lowering the tax rate by 1 cent after he was the one who pushed for the 10 cent raise in tax rate back in 2003? Tell me more.

Oh... and Wayne does not appear to have any sympathy for the dilemma that Bulle Rock residents are experiencing. Might be a bad move on his part.

Mind you... I have a certain respect for Wayne and his efforts in managing the city. I disagree with his priorities and his management manner. He had the courage to throw his hat in the ring when no one else would for a somewhat thankless job. I do respect that. Mitch feels he can have a positive impact on various issues that have been left unaddressed by Wayne. It is time for change. It is time for a new direction that considers the needs of a larger group of taxpayers and voters than served by Wayne. I hope other voters see things from my perspective.